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	<title>Comments on: Judge Elden Fox to Mahdavi: Don&#8217;t Drive Without A License, 90 days community service for maiming</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.bikesidela.org/mahdavi-and-deliz-sentencing/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.bikesidela.org/mahdavi-and-deliz-sentencing/</link>
	<description>Cyclists have the right to travel safely and free of fear.</description>
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		<title>By: SaMo road rage hearing postponed, Mahdavi goes to Europe and Shannon Richards pleads no contest &#171; BikingInLA</title>
		<link>http://www.bikesidela.org/mahdavi-and-deliz-sentencing/comment-page-2/#comment-27303</link>
		<dc:creator>SaMo road rage hearing postponed, Mahdavi goes to Europe and Shannon Richards pleads no contest &#171; BikingInLA</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Nov 2011 17:13:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bikesidela.org/?p=1484#comment-27303</guid>
		<description>[...] also notes that Celine Mahdavi, the driver given a slap on the wrist sentenced to 90 days in the hit-and-run maiming of cyclist Louis Deliz, was scheduled for a restitution hearing on October 12th, which was rescheduled for December [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] also notes that Celine Mahdavi, the driver given a slap on the wrist sentenced to 90 days in the hit-and-run maiming of cyclist Louis Deliz, was scheduled for a restitution hearing on October 12th, which was rescheduled for December [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Hannah</title>
		<link>http://www.bikesidela.org/mahdavi-and-deliz-sentencing/comment-page-2/#comment-13236</link>
		<dc:creator>Hannah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Feb 2011 08:22:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bikesidela.org/?p=1484#comment-13236</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t see what this has to do with Lindsay Lohan.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t see what this has to do with Lindsay Lohan.</p>
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		<title>By: Alex Thompson</title>
		<link>http://www.bikesidela.org/mahdavi-and-deliz-sentencing/comment-page-2/#comment-10541</link>
		<dc:creator>Alex Thompson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Jan 2011 05:56:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bikesidela.org/?p=1484#comment-10541</guid>
		<description>Max, 

Do you have any source beyond the Examiner?  I can&#039;t find any other confirmation, and the story at the Examiner is thin enough that I&#039;m not convinced of it&#039;s credibility.  But if we could confirm the story, then that would be worth writing about.

Anyway, thanks for bringing that to our attention Max!

AT</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Max, </p>
<p>Do you have any source beyond the Examiner?  I can&#8217;t find any other confirmation, and the story at the Examiner is thin enough that I&#8217;m not convinced of it&#8217;s credibility.  But if we could confirm the story, then that would be worth writing about.</p>
<p>Anyway, thanks for bringing that to our attention Max!</p>
<p>AT</p>
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		<title>By: Max Emanuel</title>
		<link>http://www.bikesidela.org/mahdavi-and-deliz-sentencing/comment-page-2/#comment-10525</link>
		<dc:creator>Max Emanuel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 02 Jan 2011 23:29:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bikesidela.org/?p=1484#comment-10525</guid>
		<description>Fox is more than notorious for cutting deals with attornies behind the backs of crime victims and their families.  He actually left several pages of handwritten notes about the deals with contact phone numbers on his personal stationary in case files.  Examples and details are online at: http://www.examiner.com/county-museum-of-art-in-los-angeles/lohan-felony-case-judge-s-record-could-impact-2011-local-elections.  The 2011 local election is a chance to stop this.  Contact your council or board of supervisor representative and ask for thier help in exchange for your vote.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Fox is more than notorious for cutting deals with attornies behind the backs of crime victims and their families.  He actually left several pages of handwritten notes about the deals with contact phone numbers on his personal stationary in case files.  Examples and details are online at: <a href="http://www.examiner.com/county-museum-of-art-in-los-angeles/lohan-felony-case-judge-s-record-could-impact-2011-local-elections" rel="nofollow">http://www.examiner.com/county-museum-of-art-in-los-angeles/lohan-felony-case-judge-s-record-could-impact-2011-local-elections</a>.  The 2011 local election is a chance to stop this.  Contact your council or board of supervisor representative and ask for thier help in exchange for your vote.</p>
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		<title>By: Hit-and-run driver gets 90 days community service &#171; Talking Treads</title>
		<link>http://www.bikesidela.org/mahdavi-and-deliz-sentencing/comment-page-2/#comment-8657</link>
		<dc:creator>Hit-and-run driver gets 90 days community service &#171; Talking Treads</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 20 Nov 2010 20:08:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bikesidela.org/?p=1484#comment-8657</guid>
		<description>[...] apparently light sentence was met with protest from bicycle advocacy groups, one of which &#8211; Bikeside LA &#8211; swore to seek legislation in Sacramento to protect cyclists&#8217; rights. One particularly [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] apparently light sentence was met with protest from bicycle advocacy groups, one of which &#8211; Bikeside LA &#8211; swore to seek legislation in Sacramento to protect cyclists&#8217; rights. One particularly [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Life Before License &#124; Blogging.la</title>
		<link>http://www.bikesidela.org/mahdavi-and-deliz-sentencing/comment-page-2/#comment-7374</link>
		<dc:creator>Life Before License &#124; Blogging.la</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 12 Oct 2010 19:47:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bikesidela.org/?p=1484#comment-7374</guid>
		<description>[...] are hit and run, and the penalties for getting caught really don&#8217;t discourage this. Recently Celine Mahdavi, the women who clobbered Louis Deliz into 49 days of hospitalization and likely a lifetime a pain and suffering, then fled the scene, was given no jail time, no [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] are hit and run, and the penalties for getting caught really don&#8217;t discourage this. Recently Celine Mahdavi, the women who clobbered Louis Deliz into 49 days of hospitalization and likely a lifetime a pain and suffering, then fled the scene, was given no jail time, no [...]</p>
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		<title>By: It&#8217;s here: Life Before License! &#124; Bikeside LA</title>
		<link>http://www.bikesidela.org/mahdavi-and-deliz-sentencing/comment-page-2/#comment-7361</link>
		<dc:creator>It&#8217;s here: Life Before License! &#124; Bikeside LA</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 12 Oct 2010 07:19:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bikesidela.org/?p=1484#comment-7361</guid>
		<description>[...] son are struck and left for dead, it&#8217;s time to do something about hit and run.  When a judge sentences a hit and run convict to 90 days community service for nearly destroying someone&#8217;s life, it&#8217;s time to do something about hit and run.  [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] son are struck and left for dead, it&#8217;s time to do something about hit and run.  When a judge sentences a hit and run convict to 90 days community service for nearly destroying someone&#8217;s life, it&#8217;s time to do something about hit and run.  [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Alex Thompson</title>
		<link>http://www.bikesidela.org/mahdavi-and-deliz-sentencing/comment-page-2/#comment-7257</link>
		<dc:creator>Alex Thompson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 Oct 2010 04:53:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bikesidela.org/?p=1484#comment-7257</guid>
		<description>It&#039;s a sarcasm thing marchtenth.  The judge has the option to take away driving privileges as a condition of probation.  Re mandatory loss of driving privileges - search Life Before License, kthxbai.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s a sarcasm thing marchtenth.  The judge has the option to take away driving privileges as a condition of probation.  Re mandatory loss of driving privileges &#8211; search Life Before License, kthxbai.</p>
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		<title>By: marchtenth</title>
		<link>http://www.bikesidela.org/mahdavi-and-deliz-sentencing/comment-page-2/#comment-7150</link>
		<dc:creator>marchtenth</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 25 Sep 2010 00:25:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bikesidela.org/?p=1484#comment-7150</guid>
		<description>The &quot;drive with a valid driver&#039;s license and insurance in your possession at all times&quot; is a standard term of probation imposed on all defendants in Vehicle Code-related cases.  Not something special for this case.

And the judge&#039;s power (or lack thereof) to suspend a driver&#039;s license is controlled by the state, not the judge.  Write your representative in Sacramento.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The &#8220;drive with a valid driver&#8217;s license and insurance in your possession at all times&#8221; is a standard term of probation imposed on all defendants in Vehicle Code-related cases.  Not something special for this case.</p>
<p>And the judge&#8217;s power (or lack thereof) to suspend a driver&#8217;s license is controlled by the state, not the judge.  Write your representative in Sacramento.</p>
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		<title>By: fred specktor</title>
		<link>http://www.bikesidela.org/mahdavi-and-deliz-sentencing/comment-page-2/#comment-6302</link>
		<dc:creator>fred specktor</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Aug 2010 22:18:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bikesidela.org/?p=1484#comment-6302</guid>
		<description>I can&#039;t stand Judge Fox....he is an arrogant jerk.  He once remanded me to custody for calling him an SOB....I was the victim of the crime and he was making sure &quot;the people&quot; not me were satisfied.  I am going to make sure I vote against him and I will try and get others too as well.  He does not belong on the bench</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I can&#8217;t stand Judge Fox&#8230;.he is an arrogant jerk.  He once remanded me to custody for calling him an SOB&#8230;.I was the victim of the crime and he was making sure &#8220;the people&#8221; not me were satisfied.  I am going to make sure I vote against him and I will try and get others too as well.  He does not belong on the bench</p>
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		<title>By: Alex Thompson</title>
		<link>http://www.bikesidela.org/mahdavi-and-deliz-sentencing/comment-page-2/#comment-6077</link>
		<dc:creator>Alex Thompson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 01 Aug 2010 03:44:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bikesidela.org/?p=1484#comment-6077</guid>
		<description>Greg,

It&#039;s a sentiment not meant to be literally true.  It resonates with cyclists because that&#039;s how it feels.  I don&#039;t think I&#039;m going out on a limb by saying it&#039;s 90% true.  I can&#039;t count the number of times I&#039;ve been told someone was hit and the police wouldn&#039;t take a report.  It happens too often.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Greg,</p>
<p>It&#8217;s a sentiment not meant to be literally true.  It resonates with cyclists because that&#8217;s how it feels.  I don&#8217;t think I&#8217;m going out on a limb by saying it&#8217;s 90% true.  I can&#8217;t count the number of times I&#8217;ve been told someone was hit and the police wouldn&#8217;t take a report.  It happens too often.</p>
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		<title>By: Greg</title>
		<link>http://www.bikesidela.org/mahdavi-and-deliz-sentencing/comment-page-2/#comment-6066</link>
		<dc:creator>Greg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 31 Jul 2010 15:18:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bikesidela.org/?p=1484#comment-6066</guid>
		<description>It seems that, even if the judge did not want to give any jail time, he could have taken Mahdavi&#039;s license for a longer time or ordered more community service.  Still, I don&#039;t think you can single him out for giving &quot;the going rate&quot; for such a collision.  Mandatory sentences for such crimes should be greater.  

Unfortunately, even if she were given a year in prison, she would likely be released within days as a &quot;non-violent offender&quot;.

Deliz is likely alive today only because of a quick response by citizens, police, paramedics, and emergency room doctors.  Alex, I think you are wrong that the police don&#039;t care.  A case would never have been filed if the police did not fully investigate.

It is important to remember the person responsible here is Mahdavi.  She drank alcohol (at 18 years old) and then drove her car.  Her character and upbringing are demonstrated by her decision to leave a man dying in the street after causing his injuries.  

We can expect many more such accidents after the vote to legalize marijuana in California later this year.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It seems that, even if the judge did not want to give any jail time, he could have taken Mahdavi&#8217;s license for a longer time or ordered more community service.  Still, I don&#8217;t think you can single him out for giving &#8220;the going rate&#8221; for such a collision.  Mandatory sentences for such crimes should be greater.  </p>
<p>Unfortunately, even if she were given a year in prison, she would likely be released within days as a &#8220;non-violent offender&#8221;.</p>
<p>Deliz is likely alive today only because of a quick response by citizens, police, paramedics, and emergency room doctors.  Alex, I think you are wrong that the police don&#8217;t care.  A case would never have been filed if the police did not fully investigate.</p>
<p>It is important to remember the person responsible here is Mahdavi.  She drank alcohol (at 18 years old) and then drove her car.  Her character and upbringing are demonstrated by her decision to leave a man dying in the street after causing his injuries.  </p>
<p>We can expect many more such accidents after the vote to legalize marijuana in California later this year.</p>
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		<title>By: Bikerumor &#187; L.A. Cyclists Fed Up With Sentencing Disparities In Hit And Run Cases Form &#8220;Life Before License&#8221; Campaign</title>
		<link>http://www.bikesidela.org/mahdavi-and-deliz-sentencing/comment-page-2/#comment-5986</link>
		<dc:creator>Bikerumor &#187; L.A. Cyclists Fed Up With Sentencing Disparities In Hit And Run Cases Form &#8220;Life Before License&#8221; Campaign</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jul 2010 21:26:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bikesidela.org/?p=1484#comment-5986</guid>
		<description>[...] for alcohol. The cyclist she hit, Jose Deliz  Louis Deliz will be permanently disabled. Read the gory details here. Another protest is planned for this Friday. Details after the [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] for alcohol. The cyclist she hit, Jose Deliz  Louis Deliz will be permanently disabled. Read the gory details here. Another protest is planned for this Friday. Details after the [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Mr.Mostly</title>
		<link>http://www.bikesidela.org/mahdavi-and-deliz-sentencing/comment-page-2/#comment-5982</link>
		<dc:creator>Mr.Mostly</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jul 2010 19:52:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bikesidela.org/?p=1484#comment-5982</guid>
		<description>This is just not right.  On the face of it the girl should have spent time in jail just for leaving the scene.  We hear nothing of the circumstances of the crash at least in this report.  Bike lane? Intersection?

I do regret that stories like this make biking seem quite dangerous.  This discourages all but the brave to get on the road.

When you look at E.R. visits due to bikes you get about these numbers - 
66% are children.
25% are Adults involved in Bike\Bike or solo accidents. All mine fall in this cat.
10% are bike\car accidents.  They are about equally divided into Car&#039;s Fault, Bike&#039;s Fault, and could not be determined.

So biking is safer than many people would believe.  We need to reach a critical mass of bikers on the road.  Mom and Pops won&#039;t do anything dangerous however.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is just not right.  On the face of it the girl should have spent time in jail just for leaving the scene.  We hear nothing of the circumstances of the crash at least in this report.  Bike lane? Intersection?</p>
<p>I do regret that stories like this make biking seem quite dangerous.  This discourages all but the brave to get on the road.</p>
<p>When you look at E.R. visits due to bikes you get about these numbers &#8211;<br />
66% are children.<br />
25% are Adults involved in Bike\Bike or solo accidents. All mine fall in this cat.<br />
10% are bike\car accidents.  They are about equally divided into Car&#8217;s Fault, Bike&#8217;s Fault, and could not be determined.</p>
<p>So biking is safer than many people would believe.  We need to reach a critical mass of bikers on the road.  Mom and Pops won&#8217;t do anything dangerous however.</p>
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		<title>By: Streetsblog Los Angeles &#187; Recent Headlines</title>
		<link>http://www.bikesidela.org/mahdavi-and-deliz-sentencing/comment-page-2/#comment-5977</link>
		<dc:creator>Streetsblog Los Angeles &#187; Recent Headlines</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Jul 2010 15:31:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bikesidela.org/?p=1484#comment-5977</guid>
		<description>[...] Damien Newton on July 28, 2010   Mad As Hell: Protesting Judge Fox&#039;s slap on the wrist hit and run sentencing in Beverly Hills at last night&#039;s Blood In. Photo: Barleye/Midnight [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Damien Newton on July 28, 2010   Mad As Hell: Protesting Judge Fox&#39;s slap on the wrist hit and run sentencing in Beverly Hills at last night&#39;s Blood In. Photo: Barleye/Midnight [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Blood In Protest Rides on Tuesday and Friday&#160;/&#160; illuminateLA</title>
		<link>http://www.bikesidela.org/mahdavi-and-deliz-sentencing/comment-page-2/#comment-5949</link>
		<dc:creator>Blood In Protest Rides on Tuesday and Friday&#160;/&#160; illuminateLA</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Jul 2010 06:37:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bikesidela.org/?p=1484#comment-5949</guid>
		<description>[...] threw herself on the mercy of the court, instead of accepting the plea deal offered by the DA.  Judge Fox gave her 90 days of community service, and 3 years of probation.  Mahdavi will spend less time in community service – 720 hours – than Deliz spent in the [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] threw herself on the mercy of the court, instead of accepting the plea deal offered by the DA.  Judge Fox gave her 90 days of community service, and 3 years of probation.  Mahdavi will spend less time in community service – 720 hours – than Deliz spent in the [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Streetsblog Los Angeles &#187; The Rest of the Week in Livable Streets Events</title>
		<link>http://www.bikesidela.org/mahdavi-and-deliz-sentencing/comment-page-2/#comment-5947</link>
		<dc:creator>Streetsblog Los Angeles &#187; The Rest of the Week in Livable Streets Events</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 27 Jul 2010 04:17:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bikesidela.org/?p=1484#comment-5947</guid>
		<description>[...] herself on the mercy of the court, instead of accepting the plea deal offered by the DA.&#160; Judge Fox gave her 90 days of community service, and 3 years of probation.&#160; Mahdavi will spend less time in community service – 720 hours – than Deliz spent in the [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] herself on the mercy of the court, instead of accepting the plea deal offered by the DA.&nbsp; Judge Fox gave her 90 days of community service, and 3 years of probation.&nbsp; Mahdavi will spend less time in community service – 720 hours – than Deliz spent in the [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Jennifer</title>
		<link>http://www.bikesidela.org/mahdavi-and-deliz-sentencing/comment-page-2/#comment-5887</link>
		<dc:creator>Jennifer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Jul 2010 21:03:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bikesidela.org/?p=1484#comment-5887</guid>
		<description>Good day to all Louis&#039; supporters. I am Louis&#039; cousin and spoke at the sentencing. What you lack in understanding is the fact that she left the scene of the collision, left him for dead, showed absolutely no remorse and went on with her life. Louis&#039;s life as he knew it is OVER. The person who thought she needed time in jail and gave that speech was my brother Tom who gave up his vacation with his wife and child at LEGOLAND to make sure Ms. Mahdavi would get jail time. Frustrated absolutely yes we are. It&#039;s what we wanted and it is what Louis needed. Yes Judge Fox is not my most favorite person and if I was Lindsay Lohan I&#039;d be rather pissed at the turn of events. I&#039;m sure she would have been much happier had she gotten Judge Fox. If the news crews only knew what happened upstairs with real life instead of celebrity life I am sure Judge Fox would have been a little bit more on the ball. Thank you for all your support those who were there and those who were not. Know that Louis&#039; extended family also thinks very highly of the bike riders out there who have been some of our most passionate supporters - Thanks again!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good day to all Louis&#8217; supporters. I am Louis&#8217; cousin and spoke at the sentencing. What you lack in understanding is the fact that she left the scene of the collision, left him for dead, showed absolutely no remorse and went on with her life. Louis&#8217;s life as he knew it is OVER. The person who thought she needed time in jail and gave that speech was my brother Tom who gave up his vacation with his wife and child at LEGOLAND to make sure Ms. Mahdavi would get jail time. Frustrated absolutely yes we are. It&#8217;s what we wanted and it is what Louis needed. Yes Judge Fox is not my most favorite person and if I was Lindsay Lohan I&#8217;d be rather pissed at the turn of events. I&#8217;m sure she would have been much happier had she gotten Judge Fox. If the news crews only knew what happened upstairs with real life instead of celebrity life I am sure Judge Fox would have been a little bit more on the ball. Thank you for all your support those who were there and those who were not. Know that Louis&#8217; extended family also thinks very highly of the bike riders out there who have been some of our most passionate supporters &#8211; Thanks again!</p>
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		<title>By: Jonathan</title>
		<link>http://www.bikesidela.org/mahdavi-and-deliz-sentencing/comment-page-2/#comment-5878</link>
		<dc:creator>Jonathan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Jul 2010 05:28:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bikesidela.org/?p=1484#comment-5878</guid>
		<description>Well said Alex, it seems that we need to start lobbying for well articulated laws pertaining to cyclist &quot;hit and runs&quot;. Any DMV license revocations for underage minors. As you remember I was sitting near you in the court room. It is my understanding that the charges against Ms. Mahdavi were rather limited due to unfortunate ambiguities with the evidence as if more articulate charges were pressed the prosecutions argument would have been more vulnerable. 

I think our biggest concern is to make sure that Louis gets restitution and financial relief to relieve his current suffering. I am ultimately pessimistic at this point of him recieving anything from the defendant or the Mahdavi family at all.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well said Alex, it seems that we need to start lobbying for well articulated laws pertaining to cyclist &#8220;hit and runs&#8221;. Any DMV license revocations for underage minors. As you remember I was sitting near you in the court room. It is my understanding that the charges against Ms. Mahdavi were rather limited due to unfortunate ambiguities with the evidence as if more articulate charges were pressed the prosecutions argument would have been more vulnerable. </p>
<p>I think our biggest concern is to make sure that Louis gets restitution and financial relief to relieve his current suffering. I am ultimately pessimistic at this point of him recieving anything from the defendant or the Mahdavi family at all.</p>
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		<title>By: Alex Thompson</title>
		<link>http://www.bikesidela.org/mahdavi-and-deliz-sentencing/comment-page-2/#comment-5874</link>
		<dc:creator>Alex Thompson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Jul 2010 01:03:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bikesidela.org/?p=1484#comment-5874</guid>
		<description>Erock - civil suit(s) come next.  Always criminal then civil . . . a finding of guilt in criminal court is admissible in civil court but not vice versa.  Therefore a criminal verdict can more or less settle the issue of guilt in a civil case, and then the debate in the civil case moves to what kind of damages are appropriate.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Erock &#8211; civil suit(s) come next.  Always criminal then civil . . . a finding of guilt in criminal court is admissible in civil court but not vice versa.  Therefore a criminal verdict can more or less settle the issue of guilt in a civil case, and then the debate in the civil case moves to what kind of damages are appropriate.</p>
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		<title>By: Alex Thompson</title>
		<link>http://www.bikesidela.org/mahdavi-and-deliz-sentencing/comment-page-2/#comment-5873</link>
		<dc:creator>Alex Thompson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Jul 2010 01:01:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bikesidela.org/?p=1484#comment-5873</guid>
		<description>Mark - I understand your point that jail time may not solve any problems.  I put to you three things - much along the lines of what Gary said:

1) The judge did not give a court order that she not be allowed to drive.  This means that when January 2011 comes around, she could be driving again if the DMV sees fit.  We should not be looking to the DMV to make criminal justice decisions.

2) No jail time sends a clear message that this sort of thing is not a big deal.  She has a felony charge - in the long run that, not jail time, will have the greatest negative impact on her.  But to everyone else, the jail time is the disincentive.  No one gives a fuck if they hit bikers and they don&#039;t in part because they don&#039;t face real penalties.  Only a fraction of a percentage of these hit and runs land in court, so someone who hits a cyclist now knows they face a fraction of percentage risk of jail time should they hit a cyclist and leave them for dead.  That&#039;s an incentive to leave the scene, and it&#039;s an incentive not to care if you hit cyclists.

3) One member of Louis&#039; family made a very salient point.  I was more in the camp that the Hospital and Morgue program, a drivers&#039; license suspension, her being forced to pay Louis&#039; medical bills, alcohol counseling, and her probation stand a better chance of changing Mahdavi than jail time.  However, Louis family member argued that Mahdavi needs time to think about, to process what she has done.  She needs to think about how horribly she has impacted Louis and whether she wants to continue to be that sort of person.  She needs to think about how she will go about changing herself, and how she can do some good things in the world so that ultimately she can forgive herself --&gt; that is the route out and up for Mahdavi.  Without time in jail, she may never confront those issues.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mark &#8211; I understand your point that jail time may not solve any problems.  I put to you three things &#8211; much along the lines of what Gary said:</p>
<p>1) The judge did not give a court order that she not be allowed to drive.  This means that when January 2011 comes around, she could be driving again if the DMV sees fit.  We should not be looking to the DMV to make criminal justice decisions.</p>
<p>2) No jail time sends a clear message that this sort of thing is not a big deal.  She has a felony charge &#8211; in the long run that, not jail time, will have the greatest negative impact on her.  But to everyone else, the jail time is the disincentive.  No one gives a fuck if they hit bikers and they don&#8217;t in part because they don&#8217;t face real penalties.  Only a fraction of a percentage of these hit and runs land in court, so someone who hits a cyclist now knows they face a fraction of percentage risk of jail time should they hit a cyclist and leave them for dead.  That&#8217;s an incentive to leave the scene, and it&#8217;s an incentive not to care if you hit cyclists.</p>
<p>3) One member of Louis&#8217; family made a very salient point.  I was more in the camp that the Hospital and Morgue program, a drivers&#8217; license suspension, her being forced to pay Louis&#8217; medical bills, alcohol counseling, and her probation stand a better chance of changing Mahdavi than jail time.  However, Louis family member argued that Mahdavi needs time to think about, to process what she has done.  She needs to think about how horribly she has impacted Louis and whether she wants to continue to be that sort of person.  She needs to think about how she will go about changing herself, and how she can do some good things in the world so that ultimately she can forgive herself &#8211;> that is the route out and up for Mahdavi.  Without time in jail, she may never confront those issues.</p>
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		<title>By: Erock</title>
		<link>http://www.bikesidela.org/mahdavi-and-deliz-sentencing/comment-page-2/#comment-5872</link>
		<dc:creator>Erock</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Jul 2010 00:55:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bikesidela.org/?p=1484#comment-5872</guid>
		<description>is there a civil suit also?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>is there a civil suit also?</p>
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		<title>By: beaver</title>
		<link>http://www.bikesidela.org/mahdavi-and-deliz-sentencing/comment-page-2/#comment-5871</link>
		<dc:creator>beaver</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Jul 2010 00:30:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bikesidela.org/?p=1484#comment-5871</guid>
		<description>think about it, she gets to pick up trash for 90 days and hes gotta live with that pain from HER actions for the rest of his life. ridiculous</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>think about it, she gets to pick up trash for 90 days and hes gotta live with that pain from HER actions for the rest of his life. ridiculous</p>
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		<title>By: roadblock</title>
		<link>http://www.bikesidela.org/mahdavi-and-deliz-sentencing/comment-page-2/#comment-5869</link>
		<dc:creator>roadblock</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Jul 2010 22:26:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bikesidela.org/?p=1484#comment-5869</guid>
		<description>totally agree with Gary, I still think jail time should be a part of the punishment though.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>totally agree with Gary, I still think jail time should be a part of the punishment though.</p>
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		<title>By: Mike</title>
		<link>http://www.bikesidela.org/mahdavi-and-deliz-sentencing/comment-page-2/#comment-5868</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Jul 2010 22:09:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bikesidela.org/?p=1484#comment-5868</guid>
		<description>I witnessed this accident and was not asked to testify...I am writing a letter to the courts and to LA Times now.  This is ridiculous.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I witnessed this accident and was not asked to testify&#8230;I am writing a letter to the courts and to LA Times now.  This is ridiculous.</p>
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		<title>By: July</title>
		<link>http://www.bikesidela.org/mahdavi-and-deliz-sentencing/comment-page-2/#comment-5865</link>
		<dc:creator>July</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Jul 2010 21:21:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bikesidela.org/?p=1484#comment-5865</guid>
		<description>I agree with Gary K. Go after their driving privileges, Make it close to impossible to get your license back in such cases (hit and run, drunk driving, etc), especially in such cases involving a cyclist. Shit, they might even have to go out and purchase a bicycle and have to commute through the city and learn for themselves first hand what it&#039;s like to be on the other end of the stick.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree with Gary K. Go after their driving privileges, Make it close to impossible to get your license back in such cases (hit and run, drunk driving, etc), especially in such cases involving a cyclist. Shit, they might even have to go out and purchase a bicycle and have to commute through the city and learn for themselves first hand what it&#8217;s like to be on the other end of the stick.</p>
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		<title>By: roadblock</title>
		<link>http://www.bikesidela.org/mahdavi-and-deliz-sentencing/comment-page-2/#comment-5863</link>
		<dc:creator>roadblock</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Jul 2010 21:15:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bikesidela.org/?p=1484#comment-5863</guid>
		<description>threat of jail time is supposed to be a deterrent. if there is hardly ever jail time awarded then drivers learn that it&#039;s worth it to run away and &quot;risk&quot; the &quot;consequences&quot; of being caught. Even at 18, Mahdavi knew it was better to run. THIS ATTITUDE HAS TO STOP and the only way it will stop is if there are REAL and HARSH consequences not just a slap on the wrist by some bitch-made county judge.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>threat of jail time is supposed to be a deterrent. if there is hardly ever jail time awarded then drivers learn that it&#8217;s worth it to run away and &#8220;risk&#8221; the &#8220;consequences&#8221; of being caught. Even at 18, Mahdavi knew it was better to run. THIS ATTITUDE HAS TO STOP and the only way it will stop is if there are REAL and HARSH consequences not just a slap on the wrist by some bitch-made county judge.</p>
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		<title>By: Gary Kavanagh</title>
		<link>http://www.bikesidela.org/mahdavi-and-deliz-sentencing/comment-page-2/#comment-5860</link>
		<dc:creator>Gary Kavanagh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Jul 2010 21:05:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bikesidela.org/?p=1484#comment-5860</guid>
		<description>Which is not to say I am advocating no jail time, sometimes it&#039;s appropriate, and if we are going to use jail time for a deterrent to crime in our society, it should be applied in an equitable fashion. What kind of justice do we have when people who commit crimes of small property damage get worse punishment than someone who damages a human being.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Which is not to say I am advocating no jail time, sometimes it&#8217;s appropriate, and if we are going to use jail time for a deterrent to crime in our society, it should be applied in an equitable fashion. What kind of justice do we have when people who commit crimes of small property damage get worse punishment than someone who damages a human being.</p>
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		<title>By: Gary Kavanagh</title>
		<link>http://www.bikesidela.org/mahdavi-and-deliz-sentencing/comment-page-2/#comment-5859</link>
		<dc:creator>Gary Kavanagh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Jul 2010 21:00:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bikesidela.org/?p=1484#comment-5859</guid>
		<description>I posted this same comment on Ted&#039;s blog on a different story, but the same comment is relevant here:

I think the approach we need to take is to remind everyone driving is a privilege not a right, and go after the driving privileges of the reckless, and in the case of hit and run, also the heartless and cowardly. I want to see in extreme cases, people banned from driving for life, their car impounded and with severe penalties if found to be driving unlicensed. I think in some cases jail time is appropriate, especially if deliberate intent is at play, but most of all I want reckless drivers off the road.

Sometimes reckless drivers have no other past history of crime or violence outside of their car, so are less of a threat to all society in general like other criminals. They are only truly dangerous once put behind the wheel controlling a multi-ton vehicle at fast speed. So lets get these people out of cars.

Additionally, losing ones driving privilege should come with class instruction on living car free. A lot of us are already living car free or car-lite by choice, but someone who has never fathomed the idea, they easily lapse into illegally driving without a license when they don’t understand alternatives.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I posted this same comment on Ted&#8217;s blog on a different story, but the same comment is relevant here:</p>
<p>I think the approach we need to take is to remind everyone driving is a privilege not a right, and go after the driving privileges of the reckless, and in the case of hit and run, also the heartless and cowardly. I want to see in extreme cases, people banned from driving for life, their car impounded and with severe penalties if found to be driving unlicensed. I think in some cases jail time is appropriate, especially if deliberate intent is at play, but most of all I want reckless drivers off the road.</p>
<p>Sometimes reckless drivers have no other past history of crime or violence outside of their car, so are less of a threat to all society in general like other criminals. They are only truly dangerous once put behind the wheel controlling a multi-ton vehicle at fast speed. So lets get these people out of cars.</p>
<p>Additionally, losing ones driving privilege should come with class instruction on living car free. A lot of us are already living car free or car-lite by choice, but someone who has never fathomed the idea, they easily lapse into illegally driving without a license when they don’t understand alternatives.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark</title>
		<link>http://www.bikesidela.org/mahdavi-and-deliz-sentencing/comment-page-2/#comment-5857</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Jul 2010 20:54:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bikesidela.org/?p=1484#comment-5857</guid>
		<description>meant to say:

**that does NOT play into

**I can easily advocate jail time and go home, but jail is reality for some people, and it&#039;s a reality I really don&#039;t wish on anyone.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>meant to say:</p>
<p>**that does NOT play into</p>
<p>**I can easily advocate jail time and go home, but jail is reality for some people, and it&#8217;s a reality I really don&#8217;t wish on anyone.</p>
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